UK Landlord Forum / Life

Hi,

Hope you're all well.

Some advice please.
We have just had a tenant vacate our rental property. He was quite happy to leave the keys and go, however before he left we said we would like to visit.

He did mention the week before leaving that he would get cleaners in, which was good to hear.
On our visit my wife mentioned that she wasn't very happy with the standard of the clean, I mentioned this to the outgoing tenant, and he just shrugged. On my look around I noticed amongst other things that the shower-bath mixer was in a sorry state, again I pointed this out to the tenant, and he didn't even reply to this.

The next day we went to the property again, my wife then went about improving the clean to her standard and spent two days doing so. No real complaints here, no cost to us apart from some cleaning materials and time. Property now spotless for the next viewings.

Now to the issue-shower/bath mixer taps. As you will know, Grohe are a relatively upmarket brand, this is what was in a sorry state. I wasn't sure how to get the taps back to a presentable condition, so emailed Grohe support pics of the damage for advice of why the taps were badly stained and how to deal with it. They replied that bleach had been used as a cleaner and that the chrome was ruined.

I then mailed the tenant with the pics, and Grohes response - his reply was to get some chrome paint from Halfords! He states it's only cosmetic and the taps still work. He did ask what the cost of replacing the taps would be. Having delved into the web, I managed to get new replacements for a very good price- he's now point-blank refusing to pay for the taps but has kindly offered to pay for the paint.

My question here is-are his cleaners liable for the damage? I've asked the tenant for the cleaning company name and if they have liability insurance to cover aspects like this. As yet, this info hasn't come through.

There are other issues which I believe will turn out OK.  How do I approach this, please, the tenant is extremely argumentative and very unpleasant to deal with. To his credit, there are no rent payment issues. His deposit is with TDS

Many thanks

My guess is that there was no cleaning company. In any case their responsibility would be to him, their customer. He would have to raise any claims.

You don' t need to get into slogging it out with him. Submit your claim for the new taps through TDS and let them decide.

Thanks for your reply.

The neighbours told us that they saw two ladies go into the property, complete with cleaning equipment.

It's only cosmetic and the taps still work.

You can't agree a resolution with the ex-Tenant, so stop inventing other ways to get the outcome you want, submit the issue through the Deposit scheme's ADR process and see where you get to. As you'll have before-and-after photos they'll have what they need. You will be unhappy with the outcome, I fear.

You're not entitled to claim for replacement taps, you can't claim new for old.

You're entitled to compensation for your loss over normal wear and tear. Clearly there's damage to the taps, which wouldn't be normal wear and tear. So your claim would be for the loss over the normal wear and tear.

However, you're also going to have to show that you made it clear to the tenant that bleach wasn't to be used on the taps, because using bleach to clean a bathroom would be pretty normal behaviour. I'd never heard of Grohe taps (so wasn't aware of them being an upmarket brand), but they look like a poor choice for a rental property (I assume they were just there anyway).

Having "chrome" that can't handle bleach sounds most odd. I have to say I'm with the tenant on this one, and suspect that the TDS will agree.

Hi,

Thanks to you all for your advice.

Some valid points taken onboard, so thank you.

I removed the taps today in readiness to take them to a metal polisher on Monday, who having seen the pics was willing to see what if anything could be done to remove the staining.

Prior to this, I was on Dr Google for info about dealing with the issue.

Using some limescale remover from Screwfix, most of a tube of solvo autosol and a powder that my wife had purchased, that you make into a paste. Using a dremel with a polishing head, I carefully proceeded with seeing what I could achieve. Surprisingly the end results although not perfect are acceptable. Rather than go through the hassle of TDS where I've been before, I'm going to ask the tenant to cover the cost of the products that I've used.

I understand that I'm not allowed to claim for my time, however today's exercise was 4 hours if not more, this without refitting the taps. I'm going to ask him for £25, if he agrees that's OK by me and ill just put it all down to experience.  Big question--what if he refuses to pay?

Thanks again to all for your help

Quote from: nalimugmug on July 06, 2024, 10:26:51 PMBig question--what if he refuses to pay?

You walk away, having taken your own unilateral steps on your own volition to rectify the issue you perceived.

There's an underlying impression I get here... that it might not be the Tenant who is "extremely argumentative and very unpleasant to deal with". Note, I only quote there - I deliberately did not use my own words - but it seems there's an aspect of making a mountain out of a molehill from both sides.

£25 is nothing to worry about unless you're in very dire circumstances... that means it's down to principles, and Landlords don't really have time for that. Mostly, we realise that £25 is a drop in the ocean compared to a monthly rent payment and we realise where our time is used best. Let me be clear - it absolutely isn't best spent doing what you've described here (you have called companies for advice, you have researched approaches, you have collected materials and consumables, you have uninstalled fixings, you have assembled tools, you have "carefully proceeded"... you now want to avoid the formal route of rectifying a Deposit Dispute... if I was the Tenant here I'd pay you the £25 (to make you go away)). Good luck to you on that, let's hope it's not become a position of principle from the ex-Tenant's side too.

To me - who has performed uncountable Check-Outs (and never yet had a Dispute) - you sound a little insane, and certainly blinkered to the point of being irrational.

Er, this does sound a little OCD you know. You are entitled to charge for the cost of cleaning materials only. In practice I have never bothered. One excellent tenant left a lot of staining on a sink, from pouring coffee bean dregs down the plughole. Another left staining from curry spices. I did the best I could, and quickly relet without any difficulty.All this angst over such a petty bit of " damage"  and £25 will make you ill if you let it.

It sounds as if you have lost other claims, and this should tell you something. 

I'm going to take a wild guess that this is a former residence now being let out. Which means that there's going to be an issue with emotions relating to the property which is distorting perceptions.

As a tenant, you have responsibilities, but your landlord has certain obligations as well. Let's break down the situation:

Tenant Responsibilities:
Tenants are typically responsible for maintaining the rental property in good condition. This includes keeping the unit clean, preventing excessive damage, and reporting issues promptly.
Normal wear and tear is expected, but damage caused by negligence or recklessness is not. For example, if a tenant spills bleach on fixtures, it could lead to damage.
In your case, the tenant used bleach as a cleaner, which resulted in badly stained chrome on the shower-bath mixer taps.
Landlord Obligations:
Landlords must provide habitable living conditions, which include necessary repairs and maintenance.
However, landlords aren't always liable for damages or breakage caused by tenants. If the damage is due to tenant actions (like using bleach), the tenant is responsible12.
Cosmetic damage, even if it doesn't affect functionality, can still be the tenant's responsibility.
Approach:
Since the tenant is uncooperative, consider the following steps:
Document the damage with photos and any communication with the tenant.
Check if the cleaning company has liability insurance. If so, they may be liable for the damage caused by their cleaning methods.
If the tenant refuses to pay for the taps, you may need to deduct the cost from their deposit (which is with TDS).
Consult local laws or seek legal advice if necessary.
Remember, communication is key. Stay professional and assertive while addressing the issue. Good luck! 😊

Greetings, Andrew

The mistake was to try to fix the defects yourself.

Either use third parties and seek their costs or DIY and don't ask for a penny.

JPK is spot on, you probably lived there previously.

Swap out with cheapest taps and still inform next tenant that they must not use cleaning materials that damage.  Put the now restored taps in a glass display case in your home so you can appreciate them.

I would hate to let out my own home. Surely it is better to just sell up and make a clean break?  If that' s not an option then hand over the management to an agent. If a tenant did not appreciate my sash windows and original fireplaces I might go a bit tonto. The taps are just cheap crap though, B&Q'  s finest.   

Quote from: nalimugmug on July 05, 2024, 10:52:48 PMHi,

Hope you're all well.

Some advice please.
We have just had a tenant vacate our rental property. He was quite happy to leave the keys and go, however before he left we said we would like to visit.

He did mention the week before leaving that he would get cleaners in, which was good to hear.
On our visit my wife mentioned that she wasn't very happy with the standard of the clean, I mentioned this to the outgoing tenant, and he just shrugged. On my look around I noticed amongst other things that the shower-bath mixer was in a sorry state, again I pointed this out to the tenant, and he didn't even reply to this.

The next day we went to the property again, my wife then went about improving the clean to her standard and spent two days doing so. No real complaints here, no cost to us apart from some cleaning materials and time. Property now spotless for the next viewings.

Now to the issue-shower/bath mixer taps. As you will know, Grohe are a relatively upmarket brand, this is what was in a sorry state. I wasn't sure how to get the taps back to a presentable condition, so emailed Grohe support pics of the damage for advice of why the taps were badly stained and how to deal with it. They replied that bleach had been used as a cleaner and that the chrome was ruined.

I then mailed the tenant with the pics, and Grohes response - his reply was to get some chrome paint from Halfords! He states it's only cosmetic and the taps still work. He did ask what the cost of replacing the taps would be. Having delved into the web, I managed to get new replacements for a very good price- he's now point-blank refusing to pay for the taps but has kindly offered to pay for the paint.

My question here is-are his cleaners liable for the damage? I've asked the tenant for the cleaning company name and if they have liability insurance to cover aspects like this. As yet, this info hasn't come through.

There are other issues which I believe will turn out OK.  How do I approach this, please, the tenant is extremely argumentative and very unpleasant to deal with. To his credit, there are no rent payment issues. His deposit is with TDS

Many thanks

I think you should make a claim through TDS for the cost of the new taps. Keep asking the tenant for the cleaning company's details. Let him know the damage needs a proper fix, not just paint. Stick to your guns and follow the formal process if needed.